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dom6:guides_and_player_improvement:strategy_articles:thugs [2026/08/09 09:29] cybertron2 [Thug Types and PD] |
dom6:guides_and_player_improvement:strategy_articles:thugs [2026/09/06 18:24] (current) naaira Rearranged it a bit |
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| ======Building Thugs and Supercombatants – Dominions 6 – An intermediate guide====== | ======Building Thugs and Supercombatants – Dominions 6 – An intermediate guide====== | ||
| - | Firstly and foremostly – I am bad at thugging | + | [[https://discord.gg/ |
| + | **Author:** Cybertron2 \\ | ||
| + | This is meant as an intermediate to advanced guide to thugging. It is far from comprehensive, | ||
| - | I will link the old article below as it contains | + | <WRAP box center 800px round> **A word from the author** |
| + | {{: | ||
| + | //Firstly and foremostly – I am bad at thugging / SC building. There are many players better than me regarding | ||
| - | [[https:// | + | The guide has been blocked into three core sections. |
| - | [[https:// | + | - The first has a lot of the theory behind thugging. It's where you find the math, the theory, the links and the like. |
| + | | ||
| + | - The third section is the tables of common thug items up to const5 and common thug buff spells up to Magic4. This is deliberate. A lot of options open up at higher magic and con7, but that would ultimately bloat the article beyond usefulness - so I've tried to keep it tight. It doesn' | ||
| - | [[https:// | + | I will link the old articles below as it contains a lot of useful information |
| - | ===== Definitions and Terms ===== | + | |
| - | ====Unit Definitions==== | + | |
| - | <WRAP column twothirds>< | + | * [[https:// |
| + | * [[https:// | ||
| - | <WRAP group>< | + | **Article Sections** |
| + | *** [[dom6: | ||
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| - | ====Other Important Definitions==== | ||
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| - | * **Protection Thug** A thug that relies on high protection | ||
| - | * **Defense Thug** A thug that relies on high defence to not get hit | ||
| - | * **HP Thug** A thug with lots of HP and some way of regenerating it | ||
| - | * **Repel Thug** A thug that stays alive by passing [[dom6: | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | =====What is a Thug or Supercombatant and why do I want one===== | ||
| - | Broadly – a Thug or Supercombatant is a heavily buffed unit that can fight a large volume of units. The basic idea is they are close to impervious to damage against their targets, so they can kill a lot and can fight without an army behind them. They usually have some gear - and are ways of converting gems and possibly mage turns into PD killers - or even army killers. | ||
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| - | Conceptually there' | ||
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| - | <WRAP box round> | ||
| - | //There are some specialized use cases as well (Counter thugs, Army Thugs (offensive), | ||
| - | < | ||
| - | <tabbox Light Thug> | ||
| - | **Light thug:** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | This is the most common type of thug - and what most players are referring to. These are units or summons with 0-15 gems worth of gear that can take on PD or small armies either alone, or with a few fluffers. These are low investment raiders that can cheaply take a border province or the like. A great deal of light thugs will fail into high volumes of PD but succeed against low volumes I will present a few examples of different types of light thugs. | ||
| - | <tabbox Light Thug Examples> | ||
| - | * A Geronte from Mekone with blacksteel plate (casting fire shield turn 1). | ||
| - | * A Polemarch from Mekone casting spells on itself (no gear or fluffer required) | ||
| - | * A def-stacked (bless) elvish commander with barding and a frost brand. | ||
| - | * A Bane (summon) with a thunder whip and a ring of the warrior. Possibly Lightly Fluffed by a Lizard Shaman (Body Ethereal + Barkskin (with 1 gem)) | ||
| - | * A Jotun Werewolf with boots of the messenger and blacksteel plate. | ||
| - | * A ungeared sauromancer from Ctis casting soul vortex t1, and invulnerability t2 | ||
| - | * A Priest Smith from MA ulm wearing armor and a helmet casting a range of self buffs (e.g. Earth Power, Body Ethereal, Fire Shield, Temper Armor, Ironskin) | ||
| - | </ | ||
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| - | < | ||
| - | <tabbox Heavy Thug> | ||
| - | **Heavy Thug:** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | This is the second most common definition of thug. Essentially - these units are self-sustaining and can deal with any amount of PD or unbuffed infantry. They typically cost more gems and require higher research. | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Heavy Thug Examples> | ||
| - | * A Twiceborned Sauromancer from Ctis with high prot armor/ | ||
| - | * A empowered golem with armor and reinvigoration items that casts phoenix pyre turn 1 | ||
| - | * A Vampire Lord with Blacksteel Plate armor casting Soul Vortex, Invulnerability, | ||
| - | * A __Very__ carefully and heavily geared Priest Smith (using as an unconventional example) - with say +4 reinvigoration on the bless, fire shield, a fluffer for Body Ethereal, a smattering of buffs (Ironskin, Fire Shield, Temper Flesh, Temper Armors, Earth Power, a Shock Spool and some form of HP regen (lets say a ring of regeneration) | ||
| - | * A heavily fluffed and highly geared Chud Jarl (MA Vanarus) with a thug bless (resists + say some reinvig) (say Ironskin, Body Ethereal, Regeneration, | ||
| - | * As an aside - MA Vanarus doesn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox A word of caution> | ||
| - | Many players have split opinions on the value of these thugs (both specifically and in principle) - since losing them is incredibly expensive and they' | ||
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| - | Two huge boons on this type of unit are magic phase movement (so they can pick their battles), and having access to stealth gear (glamor) on a scout so they can sidle away, safe from the risk of counter-thugs. They both substantially reduce the risk of losing the thug. | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | < | ||
| - | <tabbox Supercombatant> | ||
| - | **Supercombatant (SC)** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | Most people separate their definitions of Supercombatants from thugs - but the definition of a light Supercombatant and heavy thug can bleed together. Supercombatants can deal with player armies and sometimes even mages. They vary in how difficult they are to answer - a 'light supercombatant' | ||
| - | <tabbox Supercombatant Examples> | ||
| - | * A Bronze Colossus pretender with blacksteel plate (spamming shockwave) is a classic Supercombatant | ||
| - | * A twiceborned musphel jarl (with D2) and a regeneration bless casting phoenix pyre, invulnerability, | ||
| - | * An Ifrit Sultan casting phoenix Pyre turn 1 with enough reinvigoration to be fatigue positive (and maybe a life drain weapon) | ||
| - | * A heavily geared Tartarian (level 9 spell) | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | At core - the different types of thugs fill different roles | ||
| - | * Light thugs tend to be designed to harry border provinces and bottleneck an opposing player | ||
| - | * Heavy thugs tend to do best against troop heavy - mage light stacks. | ||
| - | * Supercombatants can deal with mage heavier stacks and win a war on their own | ||
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| - | <WRAP box round> | ||
| - | ===An Aside on Thug Blesses=== | ||
| - | Since thugs come online in the midgame, there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | ====Why Use Thugs Instead of Troops==== | ||
| - | Thugs have a few advantages over regular troops. | ||
| - | - Most of their cost tends to be tied up in **gems - not gold** (from itemization), | ||
| - | - Layered onto this - thugs are a way of turning gems into war value - and if the thug isn't lost, that value sticks around (as opposed to battlefield spells and the like). Particularly at around const5, it can be difficult for some nations to convert a nations gems into efficient combat value without thugs. | ||
| - | - Thugs can **stackwipe** large volumes of units for relatively low committment | ||
| - | - Thugs are **less obvious** on the game map and can be hidden / the items shuffled around | ||
| - | - Thugs tend to be **more mobile than armies** - especially if given boots. This means they threaten different tiles and it can be difficult to guard against the tiles they threaten | ||
| - | - Thugs can **solve problems** that units can't. For example, a big stack of infantry may be very hard to deal with for a nation with bad infantry (like xibalba), but a heavy thug or supercombatant may easily be able to deal with said stack | ||
| - | - Thugs can be **difficult to deal with**. It is another vector of attack for some nations that requires specific, targeted answers | ||
| - | - As an intermediate guide - we'll glance over a relevant point on this - which is if someone deploys a thug ' | ||
| - | - Thugs can take your opponents completely by **surprise**. Their armies might be geared towards your regular armies and mages - so when met with a thug in a magic phase attack might not have the tools to deal with said thug. | ||
| - | - There' | ||
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| - | =====The Most Common Traps In Thug Building===== | ||
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| - | <tabbox Fatiguing out and Dying to Armor Defeating Hits> | ||
| - | When fatigued out - you take 1/6 armor defeating hits (see below) as opposed to 1/36. It is hard to overstate how significant this is. A lot of players ' | ||
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| - | Armor defeating hits are doubly dangerous. Not only do they lower prot by 25%, they do so when you roll low on RNG. This means you're both on a lowroll, AND at 25% reduced prot. Typically - if an enemy unit gets a lucky roll - its these hits that deal most of the damage. | ||
| - | |||
| - | And just to add insult to injury, every 10 points of fatigue also lowers your defense rolls by 1 - up to -10. This means you take more hits as well | ||
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| - | <WRAP box round> | ||
| - | Say you have 29 Prot and roll a 3 when fatigued out (1/12 fights you roll a 2 or 3). You end at 25 prot (29-7+3). Meanwhile an opposing heavy infantry with a mere 16 damage highrolls a 12 (not that big a highroll with exploding DRN - it's exactly 1/6 for 12 or higher). | ||
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| - | * It's going to deal 3+1 damage (plus 25% on 3 due to slashing modifier for 4 total) - despite you having 13 more prot than its damage. And you may be tanking dozens of hits each turn, so this ' | ||
| - | * Comparatively (without fatigue penalties) - at 29 prot rolling a 3 without fatigue penalties that 12 doesn' | ||
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| - | Layered onto that - if a bunch of units are attacking (say full surround of 8X3 = 24) - you're going to average about 4 armor defeating hits per round, and .667 hits per round rolling over 12. That can easily overcome any regeneration a unit might have - since there will be occasions where you suffer 2 hits in a round (or worse). If we say a unit is not fatigued, this drops to .11 per round (armor defeating and 12+), which is much more manageable from a regeneration perspective (let alone the extra attacks that miss due to the lower defense penalties). | ||
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| - | //I apologize if the below math is bad - statistics is not my forte and I used chatGPT to help// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | <WRAP box round> | ||
| - | **A second example - Prot Tanking 28 damage Giants at 32 prot** | ||
| - | * A fatigued unit suffers approximately 6.79 damage/ | ||
| - | * Just for comparison - at 28 Damage (aka a giant) into 32 prot and 2 per square (16xturn) - we average | ||
| - | * 1 in 5.12 hits without fatigue | ||
| - | * Averaging 6.59 damage/hit | ||
| - | * 20.612 damage/ | ||
| - | * 1 in 3.59 hits with fatigue | ||
| - | * 92.4% more damaging hits | ||
| - | * Averaging 8.9 damage per hit | ||
| - | * 39.66 damage/ | ||
| - | //The lesson here is to not prot tank giants// | ||
| - | </ | ||
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| - | <tabbox Overinvesting> | ||
| - | The whole point of a thug is it is supposed to be efficient. If you're investing 50 gems, that could otherwise be put towards a global, or battlefield spells, or sitesearching remotes (etc), there are often diminishing returns unless you're making a super-combatant. Worse - if you overinvest - you create a giant neon target over the thug that screams 'loot pinata' | ||
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| - | Essentially - if you have a unit that's only going to clear PD, how many gems is that ' | ||
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| - | <tabbox Over-Aggressive Positioning> | ||
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| - | As an extension of Trap 2 - if you put a bunch of gems into a unit that can only really kill PD or unprepared forces - you generally don't want to be too aggressive as the cost of losing it is significant. Although there can be value in being aggressive and unpredictable with thugs - the gem cost of losing them is significant. The more forward positioned they are, generally the more vulnerable they are to counterthugs and opposing player tricks. | ||
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| - | <tabbox Over-Reliance> | ||
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| - | Thugs lack the siege power to knock down fort walls and generally can't ' | ||
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| - | Ultimately, thugs (particularly light thugs and raiding thugs), are generally not a players main army - and it's important to be able to win the army fights as well as raid your opponent. Otherwise, ultimately the land thugs claim will likely be reclaimed, and when the inevitable army fight comes, there' | ||
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| - | Of course, there are thug lines that convert well into stackfight lines, but the basic point remains - you need to be able to win the big fight at some point as well. It's often a mistake to place all of ones eggs in the thug basket. | ||
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| - | Heavy thugs and Supercombatants can be an exception to this general rule as they can wipe out stacks and bring a quick end to a war. However if they fail or are killed - it can also be crippling. Generally - players with no other threats to deal with can muster up some sort of response to a heavy thug or supercombatant (even if via trade) so they' | ||
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| - | </ | ||
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| - | |||
| - | =====Important Mechanics===== | ||
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| - | <tabbox The Defensive Onion> | ||
| - | |||
| - | This is one of the core concepts of building a thug - since the DRN system tends to mean any ' | ||
| - | * //If a unit attacks something with a 50% chance of hitting, and the defender has another buff that reduces the hit chance by 50%, only 1/4 attacks will hit. In other words - the first buff will block ' | ||
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| - | So the basic idea is you want to layer defenses. Lets take a simple example. We have a G2 mage. We give it some heavy armor (hard to hit), some reinvigoration on the bless (doesn' | ||
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| - | The way the DRN system works - it tends to be best to layer ' | ||
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| - | Finally - due to armor defeating hits - prot is arguably the weakest part of the onion. Because it's so easy to buff however, it's typically the one that gets the most focus. | ||
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| - | **Some Combos (Many thanks to Soron)** | ||
| - | * Mistform + Body Ethereal | ||
| - | * Protection | ||
| - | * High defense + Mirror image + Shroud of Bewilderment | ||
| - | * Fear + Awe | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Some Important Onion Layer Spells earlygame** | ||
| - | * Shroud Of Bewilderment / Awe (adds a layer to self) | ||
| - | * Body Ethereal (Adds a very powerful layer to an adjacent unit at S1 | ||
| - | * Mistform/ | ||
| - | * Skin Spells (Barkskin/ | ||
| - | * Summon Earth Power (The ONLY source of reinvigoration through magic earlygame (soul vortex later) | ||
| - | * Regeneration (Hard to cast but worthwhile. Also Personal Regeneration | ||
| - | * Bless (Sounds dumb but a thug bless can go a long way) | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Some less core but still valuable spells** | ||
| - | * Temper Armor (Generally easily accessible) | ||
| - | * Furious Warriors (Not great but can help a repel thug) | ||
| - | * Temper Flesh / Personal Quickness / Liquid Body etc (self buffs) | ||
| - | * Luck (it's not awful but if your thug is risking death - something has already gone terribly wrong) | ||
| - | * Enlarge (rarely core but it can help a HP thug a little) | ||
| - | * Cold and Fire Resists (can reduce the fatigue impact of heat or cold scales). | ||
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| - | <tabbox Armor Defeating Hits> | ||
| - | [[https:// | ||
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| - | These hits ignore 25% of prot in addition to only procing on low prot rolls. They tend to do a lot of damage and misunderstanding this mechanic is one of the most frequent causes of thug death. | ||
| - | When the defender rolls their prot roll against the attackers damage roll (2d6 exploding) if they roll a 2 – (1/36) it’s an armor defeating hit. If their fatigue is 50-99 this is 2-3 (1/12) and if immobilized (entangled or fatigue > 100) it is 2-3-4 (1/6). Then damage type modifiers (like slashing are added) – which can often stack on the damage after the armor has been reduced. | ||
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| - | For example – a 24 Prot unit is hit by a 16 damage armor defeating slashing hit. | ||
| - | You roll say a 3, and they roll an 8 (fairly standard). So 24 Prot – 6 = 18 prot total. And the hit deals 24 (so 6 damage) plus slashing modifier – 7 damage total. | ||
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| - | In a thugging situation you will receive many hits. The difference between 1/36 armor defeating and 1/6 is significant. | ||
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| - | <tabbox Fatigue Management> | ||
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| - | https:// | ||
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| - | Because of the effect of armor defeating hits and to a lesser extent – the lower DEF rolls of fatigued units – fatigue management is the easiest to mess up aspect of a thug. In short – the relevant aspects are | ||
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| - | * Melee Encumbrance | ||
| - | * Spellcasting Encumbrance | ||
| - | * Any Terrain Encumbrance (e.g high cold etc) | ||
| - | * Any Reinvigoration or Life Drain | ||
| - | * Are you undead (Generally start at 0 encumbrance) | ||
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| - | There are usually two aspects to a thug’s life cycle. The buff cycle – where it may accumulate fatigue (if it’s a mage), and the aftermath, where it tries to stay fatigue neutral or positive. Ordinarily – it is best for a thug to enter combat at low fatigue, to avoid armor defeating hits. Most thugs are fatigue neutral or positive – that is to say they don’t accumulate fatigue when they start fighting. Occasionally, | ||
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| - | <tabbox Some Important Spells and Gear> | ||
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| - | * Twiceborn is a popular thug spell as it turns a human unit (with encumbrance) into an unencumbered wight. The wight is a good chassis for a heavy thug - and typically you thug both forms. Ordinarily - when using twiceborn, you use less items and take greater risks with the human form since it's weaker and you don't mind losing it as much - then kit out the undead form more heavily due to the reduced encumbrance and increased HP tending towards a heavy thug. | ||
| - | * Earth power is a close second, being reinvigoration in spell form (allowing many units to be fatigue neutral at const 3) | ||
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| - | * The skin spells (barkskin/ | ||
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| - | * Reinvigoration items come into their own at const 5 (boots of the messenger / amulet of reinvigoration (N), and Girdle of Might (E)). Similarly – amulet of regeneration is ‘the’ regeneration item at const5. The defensive misc items also get a notch better e.g. shock spool / dancing trident. Some items at const3 need some help but can also be quite good - bracers of protection also gets buffed by Temper Armors, so on its own it's underwhelming, | ||
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| - | * At const 3 thugs can be a bit finnicky and struggle to stay fatigue positive, whilst at const5, the options tend to greatly increase. There is more variety at con7 - but const3 and const 5 are sort of the ' | ||
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| - | <tabbox Usage and Risk> | ||
| - | * Thugs can be hard to build | ||
| - | * A thug is a relatively high gem investment that could be spent elsewhere. Even a cheapish thug may cost 10-15 gems. | ||
| - | * If a thug is lost - you not only lose the gems, your opponent gains the gems | ||
| - | * For the amount of gems invested, thugs tend to be ' | ||
| - | * A thug is a giant 'loot pinata' | ||
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| - | When using a thug or supercombatant, | ||
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| - | Light thugs will tend to always have some level of risk to a PD dump of any PD type. Some are more resistant to this than others. | ||
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| - | **Edge of Territory Provinces: | ||
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| - | The second advantage of these is unpredictability. If there' | ||
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| - | **Tiles Adjacent to a Fort** These tiles are considerably riskier to attack, as the attacker can be confident that the defender has mages (and troops) inside the fort. Of course, taking these tiles is often important staging for a war, but they carry higher risks. The other, less obvious risk, is the deeper into enemy land one goes, the less paths of retreat remain. Often this means a thug's movements can be relatively predictable. | ||
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| - | The other problem with raiding these is they' | ||
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| - | **Forts and Capitals** Interestingly - players often forget to patrol these early (since the mages are on research), but once pinged they' | ||
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| - | When attacking these - there will always be the risk of both a mage/ | ||
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| - | **Catching Small, Targeted Forces** | ||
| - | Heavy Thugs and Supercombatants tend to shine in low-risk scenarios where they can wipe out a important (but ultimately small) force. The small force is unlikely to have answers to have answers to the thug, and the thug is able to accrue value at a respectable pace with relatively low risk. As a rule of thumb, this isn't going to be a main army, but splinter forces, reinforcement, | ||
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| - | **Catching Large Forces** This is mostly reserved for supercombatants and the heaviest of thugs. This tends to be high risk high reward (albeit some supercombatants are tailor made for this), but losing is generally catastrophic since you also lose all the gear your unit has. Furthermore - a skilled player moving a large force around a second nation (who has access to supercombatants) will plan for it. So for example - if you take a Musphelheim Wight Titan 20% Regen Larger Bless (dormant), it's going to be fairly obvious what you're doing and players will plan around it (that doesn' | ||
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| - | <tabbox Hammers and Cheap Thugs> | ||
| - | Three features that define a lot of thug-related play are | ||
| - | * Hammers ??Dwarven Hammer?? | ||
| - | * Units with the trait Forge Bonus (reduces gem cost = to bonus) e.g. ??Master Smith?? | ||
| - | * To a lesser extent, the site, ??The Steel Ovens??. This is a one per map site however so it is not reliable. It is significant enough a bonus however to mention. | ||
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| - | The former two are reliable ways of reducing the gem cost of items. Although they reduce an item by a ' | ||
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| - | The dwarvern hammer costs 15 gems. It essentially ' | ||
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| - | Generally - 5 gem items are sufficiently good that getting lots of them cheaply is valuable. The best of these is the Greatsword of Sharpness. With a hammer, these cost 3 gems, and can make a unit incredibly high damage and give it ARP (with a goodly bonus to atk and def). Obviously - the 2 gems saved don't care if they' | ||
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| - | <tabbox Carrying a gem or two on a thug> | ||
| - | This is one of the most overlooked things in thug building. Holding a gem or two can completely reshape a thug. Whether it be a N1 mage casting ??Personal Regeneration??, | ||
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| - | Generally however since gems are expensive, this is reserved for multiplicative spells like the above - which add additional layers of defense. It's generally a little wasteful to spend a gem on an additive bonus. Some lines can have scouts trail behind thugs slowly feeding them gems as required for this purpose. | ||
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| - | <tabbox Some Common Important Traits> | ||
| - | Thugs with stealth are considerably more survivable than ones without. Similarly - if a unit like a scout can carry a stealth item (Con5 G3 and Con7 G2), it can swap it onto a thug so it can stealth away after an attack. | ||
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| - | On a similar note, thugs with magic phase attacks can pick their targets very cleanly, and can also be hard to pin down. Magic phasing in then stealthing away can be very hard to predict and deal with. | ||
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| - | <tabbox Morale Mechanics and Thugs> | ||
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| - | **TODO - ideally get someone else to write this because god knows I can't manage self-routing on my thugs** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Add mechanics here// | ||
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| - | //Add example here (Orains)// | ||
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| - | //Add self deprecating joke here// | ||
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| - | </ | ||
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| - | =====More Important Mechanics===== | ||
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| - | <tabbox Armor Defeating Hits> | ||
| - | https:// | ||
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| - | These hits ignore 25% of prot in addition to only procing on low prot rolls. They tend to do a lot of damage and misunderstanding this mechanic is one of the most frequent causes of thug death. When the defender rolls their prot roll against the attackers damage roll (2d6 exploding) if they roll a 2 – (1/36) it’s an armor defeating hit. If their fatigue is 50-99 this is 2-3 (1/12) and if immobilized (entangled or fatigue > 100) it is 2-3-4 (1/6). Then damage type modifiers (like slashing are added) – which can often stack on the damage after the armor has been reduced. For example – a 24 Prot unit is hit by a 16 damage armor defeating slashing hit. You roll say a 3, and they roll an 8 (fairly standard). So 24 Prot – 6 = 18 prot total. And the hit deals 24 (so 6 damage) plus slashing modifier – 7 damage total. In a thugging situation you will receive many hits. The difference between 1/36 armor defeating and 1/6 is significant. | ||
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| - | <tabbox Plink Damage> | ||
| - | Every now and then a hit will get through. Most thugs need some way to regenerate damage once hit. Since a thug will absorb lots of attacks, there will be lots of chances for a highroll. Generally – a few will occur so a thug needs a plan for this | ||
| - | <tabbox Dealing Damage> | ||
| - | A thug needs a way to kill things. This is rarely a complicated problem but it is potentially forgettable so I’ll mention it here. Most thugs want some form of light AOE attack. | ||
| - | <tabbox Lategame Magical Thugs> | ||
| - | The two (arguably 3) big spells for lategame thugs are Soul Vortex (fatigue, hp regen and damage), Phoenix Pyre (Not Dying), and Invulnerability (less important but you reach it en-route to the above two). In the late game - there is an increasing volume of mage thugs (Vampires - Phoenix Pyre Golems, Teleporting Giants). These are sort of the core spells that hold those engines together. | ||
| - | |||
| - | D3 (or D2 with gems) is arguably the only ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | It is preferable to have a means of magic phase movement on a mage thug so you can drop them on the requisite tile then retreat. | ||
| - | |||
| - | There is a subcategory of mage thugs that don't use the specific spells. These tend to be either capstone mages (Ubar' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Protection/ | ||
| - | * [[https:// | ||
| - | * [[https:// | ||
| - | |||
| - | The exact formulae for protection calculation are linked above. However a quick and dirty formula is find the larger number of the two - then divide the smaller one by two and add it. For final values under 30 you can add 1. | ||
| - | * For example, at 20 Armor and 10 natprotection, | ||
| - | * That exact example is 25, but with 11 natprot or 21 armor it becomes 26 (right on the threshold). | ||
| - | |||
| - | Alternatively - you can use the actual maths (in the linked articles), or the protection table (second linked article) to calculate it exactly. | ||
| - | |||
| - | Invulnerability works similarly to natural protection. If it is higher that natural protection and the unit is hit by **Non-Magic** weapons it will apply. It does not stack with natural protection, and it does nothing if natural protection is higher or if hit by magic weapons. Two quick examples | ||
| - | |||
| - | **A lich with barkskin (10 natural protection 25 Invulnerability, | ||
| - | * A magic weapons attack. The protection scores used would be 10 (natural protection) and 17 (armor) | ||
| - | * A non-magic weapons attack. The scores used would be 25 (invulnerability) and 17 (armor | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **A Berserk ?? | ||
| - | * A magic weapons attack. The protection scores used would be 31 (natural protection) and 0 (no armor) | ||
| - | * A non-magic weapons attack. The protection scores used would be 31 (natural protection) and 0 (no armor) | ||
| - | <tabbox Encumbrance for dummies> | ||
| - | [[https:// | ||
| - | In combat there are 2 main sources of encumbrance | ||
| - | * Encumbrance. This is the amount listed on the unit card generally. This comes from heavy items, being armor and shields. | ||
| - | * Scales Encumbrance. The second point of heat/cold adds .5 encumbrance and the third adds +1.5. | ||
| - | * Traits like cold blooded add onto this | ||
| - | |||
| - | The way melee fatigue per turn is calculated is you add your encumbrance to fatigue when | ||
| - | * Every time you finish a Melee Attack (so 2 weapons is twice the fatigue) | ||
| - | * Every time you fly | ||
| - | |||
| - | Spellcasting Encumbrance | ||
| - | * Every time you cast a spell add | ||
| - | * Encumbrance | ||
| - | * Plus your shield and armor encumbrance X2 | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Wading and Army Thugs> | ||
| - | Dominions 6 introduced a ' | ||
| - | * Units 3 sizes larger or more can wade. So for example, an enlarged cavalry (size 6) can wade through human sized infantry (size 3) | ||
| - | * Trampling units can't wade | ||
| - | * Walls don't interfere with this (you can wade onto a fort wall even if you couldn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | The main benefits are as follows | ||
| - | * Thugs can be put behind lines - buffed, and will connect with the enemy army | ||
| - | * As an extension to this - the thug can script hold x5 and not worry about being trapped behind the army. This allows players to layer considerably more buffs than otherwise trying to get them to 'line up' | ||
| - | * Army thugs are more survivable as they don't need to start in or near the front line. | ||
| - | * The corollary of this is that many Army Thugs need less defensive gear than before | ||
| - | * Players no longer need holes in their lines for thugs if the thugs are 3 sizes larger | ||
| - | * If you're bad as scripting (as I am), wading units are more forgiving than having a thug stuck forever behind player ranks. | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Flying Army Thugs> | ||
| - | Any army thug that can be buffed or fluffed with flight can set up attack rear scripts after turn 5. This is very handy (especially with slow casting spells), as the thug can arrive at the backline after an opponent is off script, and after all hold/attack units have already moved several tikes. There' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Magic Mechanics and Thugs> | ||
| - | * **Self buffs spread to mounts** For example ??Personal Barkskin?? will affect the mount and the rider of a cavalry commander - as will ??Shroud of Bewilderent??, | ||
| - | * **Spells in the initial script are prioritized off-script.** This is relevant when thugs need to do hyper-specific things. For example, a LA Zematia Fire Shield Thug may want ??Healing Touch?? in its script - because when cast - it heals both the high armor rider and the mount for a considerable amount - whilst fire shield is doing the damage. | ||
| - | * **Buff spells sometimes have weird targeting rules.** | ||
| - | * **Magic Phase Attacks will land at the same time as stealth units un-stealthing and attacking the same time (not an adjacent tile).** If a thug is moving in the magic phase, and there are stealthy units, it can be important to get things to line up, especially if there are fluffers. Similarly, if a player has stealthy troops, this allows a thug to focus less on defensive gear, especially if it wades behind the main line or zips around the side. | ||
| - | * **Thugs can use gems!?**. Although obvious - a lot of players treat thugs as ' | ||
| - | * Bonus points if these gems are on a scout and swapped over so the opposing player isn't aware of them | ||
| - | <tabbox Other General Notes> | ||
| - | |||
| - | * Thugs typically get surrounded - and some lines fit 2 or even 3 to a square to lessen the impact of that. | ||
| - | * Supercombatants are always going to have a weakness. Worst case - someone can always drop curse and slowly afflict your thug/ | ||
| - | * **Taking the candy out of the loot pinata** To protect your thugs - at Const5 and 7 you can make G3 and G2 stealth helmets respectively. You can put these on a scout - move your thug in - then swap their helmet around after combat. This is a handy way of protecting your thugs when allowing you to use a head piece in combat. It's handy with high value units as you can both optimize them for combat, then have them stealth away | ||
| - | * On this topic - you can also have scouts trail behind thugs, swapping gear in and out, or just carrying gear off to safety after a raid. This way - you can mitigate risk if your thug ends up surrounded, magic phased, attacked or otherwise awkwardly positioned. | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Retreat Orders> | ||
| - | |||
| - | If you fear a thug or supercombatant drop, you can always script an army full of mages to retreat. It's not always an obvious option - but if you're moving in your own lands - this can minimize damage | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Important Thug Subsets===== | ||
| - | <tabbox Counterthugs> | ||
| - | A counter thug is essentially a very cheap variation of a thug - that is designed to kill other thugs. Typically - a counter-thug costs a fraction of what a regular thug costs - with most of its cost tied up in its weapon. | ||
| - | |||
| - | * For example - lets say player A has a protection thug. Without getting too fancy into specifics - lets say they get to 33 protection, 10% regeneration and 20HP, which is high but achievable in a few ways. | ||
| - | * A counterthug might be a single Cynocephalian Chieftan with a Greatsword of Sharpness. That is going to deal 33ARP slashing damage per round - averaging 21/hit. This kills the very elite thug in two swings (or two thugs in one turn). | ||
| - | |||
| - | Counterthugs tend to be defined by their weapons. Ordinarily they need some trait that allows them to kill a thug easily. Since they aren't designed for sustained combat - they generally don't need to worry about things like staying fatigue neutral or HP regen. | ||
| - | |||
| - | When using counterthugs - you often want a scout or similar unit present to help loot any spoils. If the enemy has a GSS of their own for example and you bring 2 GSS counterthugs, | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Army Thugs> | ||
| - | //Many thanks to Memoria// | ||
| - | |||
| - | An army thug is essentially a thug that rather than doing things solo - sits in an army. Broadly - the goal of these tends to be one of three - | ||
| - | * Make a unit semi-indestructible to hold off a large blob of troops | ||
| - | * Have a unit designed to snipe elites | ||
| - | * Have a super-DPS unit embedded in an army line | ||
| - | |||
| - | At late research, soul vortex and invulnerability almost automatically make any death mage an army thug. Earlier, players need to be a bit more creative. | ||
| - | |||
| - | Units designed to hold off large blobs of troops tend to be built similarly to ordinary thugs - albeit with a focus on survivability. They tend to accept every buff the player army can give them, then misbehave with the enemy troop line (sometimes with magic like shockwave, sometimes by just sitting in a blob and occupying it). | ||
| - | |||
| - | Units designed to snipe elites tend to be build closer to counterthugs, | ||
| - | |||
| - | Super-DPS inline units are just what they sound like. In a line of low to mid DPS units, having a few GSS thugs can suddenly make that line extremely dangerous and hard to deal with. There are quite a few ways to build these, but since it tends to be part of a troop line, the tendency is to make them fairly barebones and weapon focused. Having a unit inline stops it being surrounded and makes it considerably more survivable. | ||
| - | |||
| - | Army thugs tend to be minimalist and dedicated to a single purpose - generally more offensive in nature than a general purpose thug. An oversimplification - they can often be seen as a ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | Wading is significant on these for a few reasons (+3 size points). Firstly and foremostly it allows them to start the battle with the mage core, soak buffs, then waddle into combat through the line. Secondly, it guarantees they make it into combat and don't get stuck behind the line (and have units to their side so they don't get surrounded). Thirdly **(and for me most importantly)** it's forgiving, if you err in your positioning, | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Chaff Raider thugs> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | A chaff raider is one that operates by essentially spamming chaff units. This can be done either via a spell (like horde of skeletons), or through a couple of specific items | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Mirror of Trapped Images?? | ||
| - | * ??Amulet of the dead?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | Strictly speaking - these aren't thugs but they fill a similar niche. Typically these items are placed on high utility chassis, such as a scout (for stealth raiding) or some sort of bird (for long map moves). These units can raid small amounts of PD, particularly when two or three are sent at once. | ||
| - | |||
| - | They provide a source of stealth raiding for nations that would otherwise be lacking. It's not dramatic, but these are sufficiently useful to be worth a mention. Both items come online at Const5, and the best spells for this come on at research 5 (Evocation for Glamor (gemmed), Ench for Death). | ||
| - | |||
| - | These can also serve as solid counterthugs. Essentially there can be more chaff than the thug can deal with - ultimately overwhelming it (assuming it's not a fire shield thug). The mirror dealing false damage is particularly potent here as it helps deal with regeneration thugs | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Dealing with Returning Thugs/ | ||
| - | <tabbox Thug Answers> | ||
| - | Returning triggers at the ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | There are a few weapons that take advantage of this. ??Sword of Swiftness?? hits twice, ??Gloves of the Gladiator?? hits 4 times!! and ??Wave Breaker?? hits 3 times. All 3 are good options for dealing with a returning thug using items - especially if on a good chassis and carefully buffed. | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Magic Answers> | ||
| - | Any magic to deal with a returning thug has to kill it in one hit. If your opponent has Astral Paths (they shouldn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | Otherwise, a few specfic spells can punch through a high HP returning chassis. // | ||
| - | * ??Gifts from Heaven?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * The blood banish spells ??Infernal Prison?? and ??Claws of Kokytos?? | ||
| - | * Against non-undead | ||
| - | * For magic units, ??Control?? / ?? | ||
| - | * ??Corpse Candle?? -> This is a little buggy due to the way illwinter coded it and does a Lot more damage than regular decay. | ||
| - | * Technically charm effects work but SC's tend to have high morale. | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Magic to Counter Thugs and Supercombatants===== | ||
| - | Firstly - not all magic will work all the time. Due to the wide variety of thugs that can be built - and the large number of spells - this list will invariably be missing effective spells and answers. Nevertheless, | ||
| - | |||
| - | * **Curse:** This is the premiere anti SC anti-thug spell. It comes in a G/N and D from at early research (the latter needing gems), and dramatically increases the chance a unit will take an affliction when it takes damage. And since quite a lot of supercombatants take chip damage and rely on regeneration, | ||
| - | * **Magic Duel:** Astral thugs and supercombatants are at extreme risk in enemy astral nations due to this spell. It singlehandedly ' | ||
| - | * **Web/Earth Meld:** The ' | ||
| - | * **Mind Hunt / Soul Slay**: Although at high research, this is incredibly powerful vs thugs. It allows a defender to remotely snipe attacking thugs - often at a fraction of the gem cost | ||
| - | * **Ravenous Swarm:** This only targets undead and is particularly effective vs human sized twiceborn thugs | ||
| - | * **Damaging Spells** There are an assortment of damage spells across the various research levels that deal with thugs. Given the different research points and the different uses of thugs - it would be trite to list them all. | ||
| - | * Two famously powerful ones are at B8 ??Life for a Life?? (which essentially one shots a human sized thug), and ??Frozen Heart?? (which rapidly kills anything without CR due to dealing AN damage and has low path requirements at W1. If we go lower in the research, ??Lightning Bolt?? can also be very effective. The trait these three spells share is AN damage, so they bypass any armor. | ||
| - | * A bit more esoterically - the AOE spells at Evocation 5 fare well against a lot of army thugs - so ??Falling Fires??, ??Gifts from Heaven?? etc (arp and high damage and high aoe). | ||
| - | * **Chaff Spam** (e.g. horde of skeletons, Warrior Illusion): Not all thugs have an AOE kill mechanism. Simply spamming chaffy units can overwhelm them. This is particularly effective for nations that can deploy a low volume of mages to deal with an otherwise irritating thug | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Sacred Thugs (not supercombatants) - Relevant Incarnates===== | ||
| - | In descending order of relevance | ||
| - | * **??Fire Shield??** - This provides a defensive chassis with a kill mechanism. This allows quite a few units that otherwise couldn' | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | * **??Awe??** An exceptional Thug bless - as attacks negated by awe don't harrass a unit, so this lets a defender ' | ||
| - | * **??Stygian Skin??, ?? | ||
| - | * **??Hard Skin??, ?? | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | * **??Fear?? / ??Dread??** Generally too expensive to be good on thugs, these are technically kill mechanisms (and have historically been combo' | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | * **?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Some Incarnate Thug Examples** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Eriu Hellbless Thug> | ||
| - | **MA Eriu - Medium to Heavy Thug (Gearless) 1-2 Gems - Sidhe Lord - Ench3 Alt1 - Bless = Awe/Fire Shield/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because of the layering of defenses. The Sidhe lord has a high defense score to begin with. Then it casts Shroud of Displacement, | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Sidhe Lord?? | ||
| - | * No Gear (1 N gem) | ||
| - | * ??Personal Regeneration??, | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox MA Pyrene Arco-Hellbless Emerald Count> | ||
| - | **MA Pyrene Emerald Count Light Thug (Gearless), No Research - Bless = Invulnerability, | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This layers invulnerability onto an already high prot score and decent HP to make a very hard to kill unit. It then layers the fireshield/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Emerald Count?? | ||
| - | * No Gear | ||
| - | * ??Bless??, Attack closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox EA Yomi Arco Hellbless Dai Oni> | ||
| - | **EA Yomi ARCOBLESS ??Dai Oni??** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox EA Muspelheim standard hellbless Muspel Giant> | ||
| - | **Muspel Jarl SC - move to muspel section** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox EA Panagea Unholy Bow thug> | ||
| - | **Unholy + Bow Thug - EA Panagea** (Thanks Demonsthenes) | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ nations: | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox EA Fomoria CRUN supercombatant bless> | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | =====Sacred Thugs - Incarnateless===== | ||
| - | Quite a lot of pretender builds take an imprisoned rainbow bless - which invariably has some inflection points. Thugs can be anywhere from lightly affected by these blesses - to new strategies being enabled. The bless itself can be anywhere from one tailored to the troops - with benefits to the thug incidental - to one quite focused on thugging and supercombatants. | ||
| - | |||
| - | //As an aside - the entire bless can be tailored around the thug or supercombatant chassis. For example, a bless with 5 reinvigoration and blood surge (amongst other things) isn't going to help a troop line much - but may make a host of thugs fatigue positive. Often however with these 'pure thug' blesses - there is a real question to whether an incarnate would be better.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | These builds usually have somewhere between about 19 and 33BP - although they can theoretically go a little higher (obviously there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //33 is 6 dominion on Grey Ones with every path at +4 (-4 scales). Beyond this - it's one BP/Scale so it's heavily diminishing returns (frankly - there are considerable diminishing returns on the move to 4 in a path as opposed to 3 in terms of point cost - so between 22/24 and 33 (22 on a non-grey one chassis). | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | It's easy to go overboard on these blesses. It's all well and good to have the best sacreds or thugs in the lobby - but ultimately scales mean gold, and gold means more stuff, more scaling and more thugs. Particularly when each BP costs 32 design points or even 40 design points, there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //A general rainbow of stats generally will not substantially increase a thug's survivability. Thugs typically rely on specific stats for survival - and often the others will be wasteful. For example - a fire shield thug has little need for attack (unless doing some fancy tricks with repel). So as a rule of thumb, thug blesses tend to lean into a limited number of stats - be it attack (on a repel bless), defence (on an elf bless) or reinvigoration (for fatigue neutrality). // | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | Finally it is worth mentioning the popular 'no weaknesses' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Common Blesses> | ||
| - | **Anti-Troop** | ||
| - | * Reinvigoration (fatigue management) | ||
| - | * Blood Surge (A very nice trait for a solo thug - lots of relevant stats) | ||
| - | * Defense Stacking (Defense and Blur) - (For defense thugs) | ||
| - | * Heroism (A sideways form of defense stacking) (For defense and repel thugs) | ||
| - | * Atk!? - For repel thugs (Rarely good) | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Heavy Thug Friendly** | ||
| - | * Enlarge (for HP/ | ||
| - | * Resists (to make answers harder and to reduce fatigue in bad terrain) | ||
| - | |||
| - | **General** | ||
| - | * Mountain Survival (2 terrains for 1BP - this is very efficient mapmove) | ||
| - | * Undying/ | ||
| - | * Unaging (Specifically for old age thug units) | ||
| - | * Mending Bones (Specifically for twiceborn Heavy thugs) | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Classic Defense Stacked Army Thug (Panagea)> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **5 Gems Gear ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This thug stacks defense to the sky. The basic idea is that the basic thug starts with 15 def, and you can relatively easily get +8 to +9 from the bless, +2 if using quicken self and another +2 to +6 from items. At 27-32 def, (although fatiguing out is still a problem), unless immobilized or shot with arrows, nothing is going to be able to hit that in a line formation - including most opposing thugs. Variants like this can lightly raid but really shine when embedded in armies since not being surrounded means they' | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * Bless contains +5 Defense, Blur, Blood Surge (+8 total), 1 heroism, on top of other things (averaging around +9 def). Bonus points for reinvigoration 2 to hit fatigue neutrality. | ||
| - | * ??Bless??, ??Quicken Self?? (on w variants), attack closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Jann Emir Reinvigoration Thug> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **0 Gem gear light raider thug** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | //The Jann Emir has everything a thug might need - good paths, a decent chassis, great stats, stealth. It just has massive fatigue issues with encumbrance 6. This can easily be fixed through either careful scripting (ew), or a forgiving bless with +5 reinvigoration + Blood Surge (for 6 total). These lines do benefit significantly from some gear (e.g. a 2H weapon like a GSS removes 2 fatigue per spell cast), but the basic build works gearless.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The spells they cast change quite significantly based on the point in the game, but the main ones of note are Bless, Flying Shield, Summon Earthpower, Shroud of Bewilderment, | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Do up a clean build AFTER fatigue section is done. Use a comparable bad build as an example (fatigue out)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | ===== Math for Nerds===== | ||
| - | |||
| - | Code for python to calculate damage (had to be done in a word doc so it has to be copy pasted to python annoyingly) | ||
| - | |||
| - | {{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | --- | ||
| - | TODO | ||
| - | |||
| - | * HOW NOT TO MAKE A THUG (lets use my own horrid examples) | ||
| - | * Extend Failcases | ||
| - | * Fill in missing entries | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **LATE IN THE PIECE** | ||
| - | * Second round of feedback | ||
| - | * * a section that shows some thugs / SCs that explains how you should identify what their strengths and weaknesses are and how to deal with them. | ||
| - | |||
| - | -- | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Sample Army Thugs===== | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox LA Agartha Blindfighter Army Thug> | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **LA Agartha 5 gem Blindlord army thug** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * Hold Hold attack closest (hold attack on blindfighters) | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Jotunheim Cheap Giant Army Thug> | ||
| - | **MA Jotunheim - Cheap Giant Army Thug / Counter-Thug - 10-15B ** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because its incredibly cheap. It only uses blood slaves, hits hard, and is on a non-mage sacred commander so can accept a bless. Weapons can be interchanged, | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Jotun Herse?? | ||
| - | * ??Flesh Eater?? (X1 or X2),??Ring Of The Warrior?? | ||
| - | * Attack Closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Some All Rounder Army Thugs / Counter Thugs===== | ||
| - | <tabbox Classic Elf Counterthug/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | **5 Gems Gear ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because the thug chassis is already hard to hit/kill, and given a ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | //As an aside, with a longer script - this unit could be used as an army thug, and with enough def on the bless, potentially a very light raider (light thug). ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Personal Luck??, ??Bless??, Attack Closest (Only 2 scripted slots so low fatigue and attacking early interrupts enemy buff scripts by getting the first whack). | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Piercer Counterthug (may need 2 on harder targets)> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | **10-20 Gem AN bow Counterthug on any chassis** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The power of this counterthug line is its simplicity. It fires an AN bolt round 1 that's going to kill a great deal of targets. If you have 2, that's 2 AN bolts. Combine that with a decent chassis (there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Note this really only works against low HP targets. The unit holding the piercer will likely die if the target ever makes it pass the buff script.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Since the unit never goes into melee, this can serve quite nicely in an anti army-thug situation if your opponents thugs are on a predictable chassis (e.g. horses). It IS a bit of a surprise tactic though - since a player (with air access) will start buffing air shield once they know these are flying around.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Horse Tribe Chief?? (This chassis is quite nice because of the high mapmove so it can zip around your lands defensively). It can also use fire - Keep distance against melee thugs. | ||
| - | * ??Piercer?? | ||
| - | * Fire Closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Blood Slave Counterthug/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **MA Jotunheim - Cheap Giant Army Thug / Counter-Thug - 10-15B** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because its incredibly cheap. It only uses blood slaves, hits hard, and is on a non-mage sacred commander so can accept a bless. Weapons can be interchanged, | ||
| - | |||
| - | * Jotun Herse | ||
| - | * Flesh Eater (X1 or X2),Ring Of The Warrior | ||
| - | * Attack Closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox MA Ulm Knight Thug> | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **Ulm Barebones Black Lord Army Thug (1 Gem with hammers!!)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | //This is a barebones, no nonsense army thug (or counterthug). Other nations can do similar things, or use indie heavy cavalry, but it works best on ulm due to their multiple earth gem discounts to forging - so this can cost as little as 1 gem and provides quite a lot of killing power on an armored chassis.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //They get stronger when fluffed with low level earth spells (Temper Armor, Strength of Giants) and body ethereal (a classic). Obviously | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Black Lord?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * HoldX3-5. Attack Closest | ||
| - | * Best with a random mage fluffing ??Temper Armors??, ??Strength of Giants??, ??Body Ethereal?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Vampire Lord Thug> | ||
| - | **Vampire Lord Light Thug - 96 Blood Slaves (0-10 gems)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The reason this thug is good is it's immortal (so your advantage rarely shrinks unless it gets seduced or the like), spammable at blood 8, and a flying stealthy thug that can raid distant provinces. Essentially - because its raids are ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This flies, is immortal (so is low committment), | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Also notable - this can be magic phased with ??Hell Ride??// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Vampire Lord?? | ||
| - | * [No Gear or 5 Gem Armor] | ||
| - | * ??Soul Vortex??, [Spells (Can end on Reinvigoration with 1 Slave)] | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Hammer of the Mountains Counterthug> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **5 Gem Hammer of the Mountains Cyno/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This is an incredibly barebones counterthug. It is designed to deal with small units with the AOE stun - essentially stunlocking them until they die. It is effective against low str targets and defense stackers. This won in the arena against an objectively stronger unit through stunlocking it in Lucids Tournament Finals 2026.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Hammer of the Mountains?? | ||
| - | * Attack Closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Common Answers===== | ||
| - | <tabbox Prot Supercombatant> | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | //Broadly - prot supercombatants tend to be vulnerable to construction items that give AN or ARP. Items like ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Defense Thug > | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | ??Web?? and ??Earth Meld?? tend to be the best answers at early research, albeit plain damage spells tend to do alright. The big ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox The Overgeared Supercombatant> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | ??Curse?? chipping, AN/ARP weapons (to some extent), some specialized gear (like ??Star of Heroes??) are all solid in the earlier phases of the game, ??Axe of Hate??, ??Gate Cleaver?? are decent later on, and generally there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | It should be mentioned the above answers are often finnicky at the best of times. But the reason for that is an overgeared supercombatant represents a huge committment, | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox The Small Wight Mage> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | There are a few dedicated items for dealing with these. ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | ??The Ravenous Swarm?? is quite effective as a spell since it only targets undead. It's especially good in army fights where there are a few wights in someone' | ||
| - | |||
| - | Otherwise - general anti-thug tricks work. These smaller wights tend not to be too hard to deal with - but have high mapmove and can be kitted out in a variety of ways - so their unpredictability and speed makes the real threat. The real ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | It's worth mentioning these can be kitted very lightly - or very heavily, based on both the user and paths. A counterthug may work well against a lightly geared wight mage, but one with a load of paths, gear and high research may be harder to deal with. | ||
| - | |||
| - | Mid-Lategame - Fire Death wights specifically can pose real problems due to ??Phoenix Pyre?? + ??Soul Vortex??. The solution typically is to either kill it really fast, use ??Axe of Hate?? to kick its fatigue up so Pyre turns off, or use some fancy magic trick. The pyre vortex variants though really serve as light supercombatants so watch out! | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox The Demilich> | ||
| - | So the ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | * **??Curse?? variants.** Essentially - if the demilich is cursed it will accrue afflictions. They all reduce its effectiveness, | ||
| - | * **Magic phase a fort under it.** If a demilich gets teleported onto a fort - it can be quite hard to get it off. Typically, a player has to use a remote attack on their own demilich and kill it (and hillariously - the demilich being tough to kill often makes it hard to kill with remotes). Even if not a permanant solution, this is a passable one (and also protects the troops that would be inside | ||
| - | * **Banishing to the shadow realm**: ??Infernal Prison?? and ??Claws of Kokytos?? are passable short tetm solutions | ||
| - | * **Soul Slay:** Although hard to pull off due to the mage volume required (and likely sacrificed) and the high MR of the demilich (plus it being somewhat predictable for an astral nation) - this kills the Demilich for good (well until they call god it back up at least) | ||
| - | * **Sic the demilich player on someone else** Not really a solution but Diplo can mean someone else suffers the demilich for a while | ||
| - | * **Set up a dramatic line to pop the enemy capital** With the capital gone - the demilich dies for good. If you can pull off some sort of one turn siege shennanigans line (very hard to do most of the time), and win the combat, the cap will be taken and the demilich will die for good. Remember, you have to ' | ||
| - | * < | ||
| - | * < | ||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | =====Common Pretender Supercombatants===== | ||
| - | <tabbox Bronze Colossus> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This is an inanimate pretender with innate caster, lots of prot, lots of resists, and air paths so it can teleport. Earlygame, a lot of nations simply can't answer this or require extremely dedicated answers. The bronze colossus - albeit boring - has a bad habit of winning games due to wiping out stacks with ease, and being a magic phase monster// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //In theory it's a little vulnerable to thugs - GSS lines, Smasher' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Normally, this unit will cast shockwave on spam for damage - albeit iron fists also works on hard targets. Finding the goldilocks balance of gear can be tricky - but this unit generally likes a lot of buffs. Just because it's a one man army doesn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //One core thing to remember - even though it has innate caster and is inanimate (low fatigue), if you give it too much encumbrance and a lengthy buff script - the fatigue can be non-trivial. Since any non armor-defeating hits are likely to do nothing - this is a real consideration.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Demilich> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Demilich V1 - Battlefield Spells - 0-10 gems of gear, 3 gems to teleport, 1-2 D gems** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because the demilich is immortal, and can use innate caster to bonk an entire army at the start of combat with some crippling battlefield wide spell. The basic idea is it teleports in, kills everything or mames everything (e.g. with disease), and either wins (fine), or dies and respawns, ready to do it all next turn, and the next turn etc. It wears Magic Penetration gear to increase the kill potential// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Because the Demilich can do this time and time again, it rapidly can wear down any force not inside a fort, killing large volumes of mages and troops. It can singlehandedly make it difficult to move stacks around in the mid-lategame. Since few answers deal with it permanently (and if an opponent has answers, the user presumably takes precautions), | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Such a build benefits from Blood4 due to the bonus 10HP, needs S3 (teleport), and at least D6 (Bone grinding). The rest of the pathing on the pretender can vary significantly based on player preference - albeit A1 is popular for Wind of Death// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Eye of the Void??, ??Spell Focus?? | ||
| - | * ??Bone Grinding?? OR ??Wind of Death?? -> Other Spells or recasts [also a 5x Magic Duel variant] | ||
| - | |||
| - | **V2 - Phoenix Pyre Variant - 4 Gems (No Items)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This is essentially the anti-PD variant. It's an ungeared or reinvig geared variant that just keeps respawning and killing things with magic. Technically you can put the two builds together, but they have quite different functions and will often want different spells (It's not bad on wind of death to keep the spell up for longer). Of minor note - if the tile doesn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * No Items | ||
| - | * ??Phoenix Pyre??, ??Soul Vortex??, Other Spells (?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Immobile Rock> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | __Why The Early to Early-MidGame Innate Caster Giant Rock Pretender Supercombatant Works __ | ||
| - | |||
| - | //At this phase of the game a big, inanimate, teleporting rock can be very hard to deal with. Layer on a few defensive buffs, and you have a super-combatant that can't move (ergo can't retreat) - so if it survives the combat - will rout the enemy. Of course, these big inanimate units tend to have a bunch of HP and can also just kill entire armies. However given the value of ones pretender - the safest use for these is picking off fringe parties, since dropping on someone' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //A popular meme strategy is getting some form of rock pretender awake and teleporting onto someones capital. It has its risks and problems, but if you can pull it off, it can obviously be crippling in a first war situation. Of course, this also leaves you on an awake researcher line with 'at best' an out of commission pretender for other players **(or a big honking trade partner for a third party with E forging)** - killing your pretender - leaving both players crippled and likely in a hellwar - in a position for said third player to swoop in). And if the monodrop fails for some reason, that's a very good way to knock one's self out of the game. As such - monodrop buids tend to be a bit of a meme// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Typically this type of supercombatant has a few glaring weaknesses.// | ||
| - | * They tend to die quickly to construction 3 E items - so they often need to take care. In higher skill lobbies, these items will be traded around in the hopes of sniping such as super-combatant so a nation' | ||
| - | * They tend to be very reliant on either Prot (e.g. Monolith) or a high HP pool with some defenses (e.g. Baphomet). Accordingly - they are vulnerable to high damage/ | ||
| - | * They tend to take some chip damage in a fight - so can't 'go forever' | ||
| - | * They want to teleport onto labs if possible so they can teleport to safety after | ||
| - | * It can be awkward getting the research needed to use these in a timely manner. They typically need Thamuturgy4 for the teleport, but their actual combat spells come from other paths. As such, they can often come online later than one might expect (since a user needs multiple researches at 2-4) where they are more vulnerable | ||
| - | * Come the midgame - these aren't incredibly sturdy. It's the phase before battlefield wipes - so they don't kill quickly - but after research 3-4ish, so players have some good magic, Evocation is creeping up in damage and construction items are flying around. They' | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | __**Build 1 Mid Research Rock + Battlefield Wipe** | ||
| - | __ | ||
| - | |||
| - | //These are often empowered. There' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This works because it combines 3 things. A big, hard to kill chassis, innate caster for quick casting, and a spell that kills everything. There are variants of this, some for cap defence (like god block and sphinx), others that can teleport (like monument), but the basic concept is the same.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??God Block?? | ||
| - | * No Gear Required (but typically a misc slot is equipped | ||
| - | * ??Foul Vapors?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | __**Build 2 Late game Idol of Sorcery Soul Drain SC** | ||
| - | __ | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Note there isn't an idol of sorcery img on the wiki so we're using a monolith for now// | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Unempowered Lategame Idol of Sorcery** | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Idol of Sorcery?? | ||
| - | * ??Eye of the Void??, ??Amulet of Antimagic?? | ||
| - | * ??Soul Drain??, ??Soul Vortex??, ??Astral Shield??, ??Body Ethereal??, ??Shroud of Bewilderment?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Protection Expander> | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | =====Some Light Thugs===== | ||
| - | <tabbox Xibalba Camazots Thug> | ||
| - | **MA Xibalba - I can't believe it's not a vampire lord (Invuln Vortex Thugs)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Camazots (D2) Cheap Backline Raider/Army Thug 2-3 gems + 5-10 gems of gear** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The basic idea of this thug is it's cheap (it carries 2 gems to cast invuln and vortex), flies (so it can attack rear), and has D2 for invuln/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | //They also can swap between skelespam lines and the above, so countering them can be complex due to the different attack vectors. Stealth and flying also do a lot for hitting annoying tiles.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Finally (and hilariously), | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox MA Pan Ackerbeltz thug> | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | Pending Coinneach MacAilpein | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox EA Vanheim Vanjarl Paired Thug> | ||
| - | **Pair of Vanjarl Thugs - 20 Gems Total - Radier and Army Thugs (weapon interchangable)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | //A stock Vanjarl Thug Line. Items be shuffled around with Barding/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Broadly - in these lines - blur/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Vanjarl?? X2, | ||
| - | * ??Girdle of Might??, ??Frost Brand??, | ||
| - | * Caster 1: ?? | ||
| - | * Caster 2: ??Blur??, ??Air Shield??, Bless, HoldX2, Attack Closest | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Ephor Fire Shield Prot Thug> | ||
| - | **Ephor Fire Shield Thug (5 gems)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | //This essentially is a prot thug that relies on Ench3 (??Fire Shield??) for damage. It works because for 5 gems - you get a very hard to kill unit with about 30 prot, not desperately high fatigue and a killing mechanism. It may be at a mathematical level better to skip temper armors for fatigue reasons. Notably - other nations like ulm have similar variants. Certain players like Monkeydew like layering this with a dormant Obfuscate bless for a very annoying raider.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Fire Shield??, ??Earth Power??, ??Personal Ironskin??, ??Temper Armors?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | ** Ephor Fire Shield Thug BAD VARIANT(30 Gems)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | // This fails for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the extra prot for the most part doesn' | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Full Blacksteel Plate??, ?? | ||
| - | * ??Fire Shield??, ??Personal Ironskin??, ??Temper Armors??, ??Strength of the Giants?? | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Some Heavy Thugs===== | ||
| - | <tabbox EA Atlantis Basalt King Heavy Thug> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **20 Gem Basalt King Light Thug / Army Thug** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Earth Fire paths and built in fear make for a good protection thug chassis. These can be chancey to use due to being Slowrec (and ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The Basalt King raid into almost any volume of PD in a pinch but does best as an army thug where the fear can really put in work. Theoretically, | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The Basalt King can be kitted as a light thug, army thug, or heavy thug and accepts a thug bless well. Generally used as a 20+ gem heavy thug due to the high cost and 2 cap turns.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Basalt King?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Summon Earthpower??, | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox MA Machaka Pyre Vortex thug> | ||
| - | **Machaka Phoenix Pyre Soul Vortex Anti-Infantry Heavy Thug [25-30 Gems] (Twicebornable)** | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This is a straightforward Fire/Death Pyre/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | Assuming wiki is in-date [[https:// | ||
| - | |||
| - | //If you're incredibly greedy - you can cast twiceborn on these then cast transformation (or do it the other way around albeit twiceborn will cost more gems) and hope for a giant chassis. This essentially will turn it into a proper supercombatant (in both forms). When supercombatanting - you would gear more extensively.// | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Black Sorcerer?? | ||
| - | * ??Skull Staff?? [Any Armor], ??Boots of the Messenger??, | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox MA Naba Malikah - Multifaceted Thug> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px>{{ : | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | //The Malikah is quite a complicated thugging unit. Naba gets access to a range of buffs - so it can have a lot of buffs painted on. It has good paths (is slowrec so is expensive), solid stats (especially in magic scales), decent HP and human encumbrance (3). It even has flying/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The basic spells it wants to selfbuff (on Naba's paths) are | ||
| - | ??Shroud of Splendor??, ??Shroud of Bewilderment?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | //It wants a few spells fluffed. Ideally it wants a skin buff like ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | //Put all this together and you have a lot of defensive layers at around research 3-4, albeit fatigue remains in issue. Fortunately - the self buffs aren't especially fatigue heavy, but a complicating factor is the best fatigue regen items come at con5 (albeit ??Rangers Boots?? exist at con3) and naba has limited N access in any event. As such, the earth random tends to be the best one for ??Summon Earthpower?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | //You can build this a few different ways - as a cheapo thug, with a weapon element (like repel), as a mage, as a heavy thug with a shield. There' | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Example Malikah Heavy Thug - 15 gems (earth random) - 1 gem carried - Research 3. ** | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Malikah?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Summon Earthpower??, | ||
| - | * Fluffed - ??Blur??, ??Bless??, ??Temper Armors?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **Example 2 Malikah Heavy Repel Thug (E random)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | //This line requires at least +2 Reinvigoration on the bless (e.g. via a ?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Malikah?? | ||
| - | * ?? | ||
| - | * ??Summon Earthpower??, | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | =====Golem Thugs===== | ||
| - | <WRAP box round> | ||
| - | //There are a couple variants of golem thugs. Historically, | ||
| - | < | ||
| - | <tabbox Phoenix Pyre Golem> | ||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Controversial Phoenix Pyre Golem Light Supercombatant - 130 Gems** | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | * ??Golem?? (Empowered F1) - 1 F Gem equipped | ||
| - | * ??Starshine Skullcap??, ??Amulet of Reinvigoration??, | ||
| - | * ??Phoenix Pyre??, ??Fire Shield??, ??Astral Shield??, ??Body Ethereal??, ??Resist Magic?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Prot Golem> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Prot Golem Heavy Thug (85 Gems)** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | //Due to being mindless, this can be a useful way to kit out a golem. It's far from invulnerable, | ||
| - | * ??Golem?? | ||
| - | * ??Frost Brand??, ??Charcoal Shield??, ??Starshine Skullcap??, ??Armor of Knights??, ??Boots of Stone??, ??Chains Of Reconstruction?? | ||
| - | * ??Astral Shield??, ??Body Ethereal??, ??Resist Magic?? | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox Horror Harmonica SC Golem> | ||
| - | |||
| - | **Horror Harmonica Golem - 130 Gems Core, usually with another 30-40 gems in Armor, Misc Slot, Boots, Weapon/ | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | //This is one of the most feared supercombatants in dominions since any nation can make it. It is one of the big payoffs for being the first person to construction 9. Essentially, | ||
| - | |||
| - | // | ||
| - | |||
| - | * Golem | ||
| - | * The Horror Harmonica, Ring of Returning, Starshine Skullcap (weapons and armor to preference but with a goal to not get 1shot) | ||
| - | * Summon Horror X5. | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | **Why this unit is so annoying** | ||
| - | |||
| - | Firstly and foremostly - this is quite threatening and can take on essentially any amount of PD and smallish armies including with light mage support. On top of that - it's generally very hard to deal with permanantly due to ring of returning. So it teleports around the map, accruing value on small to medium targets. In that sense it's like a demilich-lite. | ||
| - | |||
| - | There are a small variety of answers to this unit - mostly focused around a unit with const gear hitting really hard and killing the golem in 1 round before ring of returning pops. For example - Dalts Reccomends a Golem of ones own with Gloves of the Gladiator to deal massive damage in one turn and kill the golem. A players gets the attack ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | The big problem is - if there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | <tabbox The Anti-Golem, Golem Counterthug> | ||
| - | **TO ADD - KNOWN QUANTITY BUT NEED AN EXAMPLE** | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP column 100px> | ||
| - | //The basic idea of this unit is it allows nations with limited magic phase access to use a golem as a magic phase counterthug. It's very expensive, but the idea broadly is if you can bonk a heavy thug - the gear recovered offsets some of the cost - and it's fairly low risk since it's magic phase and presumably in your own lands (enemy raiding), and the payoff can be quite lucrative. Players may need a scout or two in position to ' | ||
| - | |||
| - | //The specifics of the golem will depend a lot on the specifics of the enemy thug. As a rule of thumb - counterthugging heavy thugs is best with highly damaging weapons (ARP/AN 2 handed), and the golem will want a S booster (Meteoric Coin or Starshine Skullcap), but beyond that there' | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | </ | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | =====Common Thug Items===== | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Prot Thug==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //All good sources of prot, Full blacksteel also having 4 encumbrance (which is generally too much for a thug)// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //Ice Armor means this is the only shield that grants straight prot as well as parry//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Not great as you usually would want a mage to buff this – but useful in a pinch//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Straight prot on a misc slot. Also this stacks with temper armors as a new slot – so when used together is +6 Armor (and much better)//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Providing essentially any random unit 21 prot for 5 gems, this is a cheap item for low cost thugs// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //High Damage, gives berserk and some prot, and cheap//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //These are generally too expensive for thugs at 10 gems each, but tend to be good on Supercombatants// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Repel Thug==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //Sometimes used on pretenders for repel builds// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Less commonly used than thunder whip due to gem cost and lower damage, this is the best item for ‘stymying’ a large block of infantry to a standstill. Has +3 attack compared to thunder whip//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Sources of ATK//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Sources of ATK// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //Rarely used – but deals fear on hit and +3 attack//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Similar to thunder whip but more damage and stats// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Defense Thug==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //+6 Defense and 0 length (so you can wield 2 weapons), this is the premiere defence thug item//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Expensive but +4 Def// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Defensive Layer==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //It’s a shield and it weakens attackers// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Grants Luck. Most useful when preventing magic phase remotes like seeking arrow.// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //It’s a shield and a damage source//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //The gold standard in dominions 5 – since nerfed and now bad.//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Blocks 50% of attacks but 10 gems. Generally reserved for SuperCombatants// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Providing 4MR this tends to be used for Supercombatants// | ||
| - | **??Shroud of the Battlesaint?? | ||
| - | //A way to get a bless on a non-sacred unit// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Damage Layer / AOE Damage==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //A useful, if underwhelming source of AOE damage//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Not just for Djinn – this applies weapon blesses and can pop glamor images//\\ | ||
| - | //(Did they fix this?)// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //A useful source of AOE damage//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //An awkward weapon but a way of dealing AOE damage//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Fear plus a high damage arp attack (weaker than GSS though – you take it for the fear)//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Provides fear on a helm. After being nerfed to 5 fear for 10 gems it’s not very efficient// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Provides Shock Damage when hit (which can stun)//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Has a large AOE effect that is good for clearing out chaff, particularly summoned chaff (undead/ | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Reinvigoration/ | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //A lot like boots of the messenger except no mapmove and only 2 regen. Comes at con3 however// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //Provides Life Drain. This serves as HP and fatigue regen//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Good mapmove and reinvigoration – a staple thug item//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Great reinvigoration but expensive. Generally reserved for supercombatants// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Provides reinvigoration on an E item.//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Provides Regeneration// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====All Purpose==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //Deserves a category of its own. The single strongest thug item//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | // | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //Gives Stealth as well as +1G//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //High Damage, Gives Prot, Very Cheap. Can be spammed on blood nations for very low cost.// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Counterthug / Anti SC Items==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | //Deserves a category of its own. The single strongest thug item//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Anti SC items, the former for inanimates, the latter for heavily armored SC’s//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Anti SC items, the former for inanimates, the latter for heavily armored SC’s//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Hard to forge but a very early source of AN//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Hard to forge but a very early source of AN//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Stunlocks low str thugs//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Deals AN against light thugs.//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //This curses enemy supercombatants// | ||
| - | **??Black Bow of Boutolf??** < | ||
| - | //Not as good as it looks (needs to deal damage), but automatically feebleminds.// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Deals ARP and causes bleeding – very potent against Armor heavy small/ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //An item specifically useful to counterthug human sized undead like twiceborn wights// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | //Deals AN to magical//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //High Damage, deals chest wounds//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //Rarely better than flesh eater – but occasionally on high HP targets the heart finding can be very relevant// | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //A bit of a strange one, these can be spammed on scouts and can overwhelm a thug. The former is better for this//\\ | ||
| - | {{path> | ||
| - | //A bit of a strange one, these can be spammed on scouts and can overwhelm a thug. The former is better for this//\\ | ||
| - | **??Midget Masher??** < | ||
| - | //Come midgame on a large unit, this can one-shot a lot of things. Can easily do 70+ damage per hit// | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | =====Spell Table (to research 4)===== | ||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Multiplicative Fluffable==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter center> | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Multiplicative Selfbuffs==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Additive Fluffable==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | |||
| - | <WRAP group> | ||
| - | ====Additive Selfbuffs==== | ||
| - | <WRAP column quarter> | ||
| - | </ | ||
| - | </ | ||